Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章technobabel » 週三 1月 06, 2010 3:40 am

I was a bit taken-aback to see the display of "Taiwan Up" on Taipei 101.
This shoot-from-the-hip wording is "cleverly" unconventional.
The meaning of this word combination is not too difficult to ascertain if you really have to.
But why did so many native English speakers claim that they don't understand?
Let me tell you why.
This is the case where wild-guess triumph over educated-guess.
Native speakers with the burden of knowing too much can only take educated-guesses, and their tolerance for ambiguity is much lower. Non-native speakers are more used to taking wild-guesses, and their tolerance for ambiguity is much higher.
It may seem that way, but English (like any other languages) is really not that malleable.
Asking native speakers to take wild-guesses is like asking them to re-learn their own language, and that is next to impossible.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_an_'educated_guess'
I am not abandoning Yoyo, I am just dancing slowly away from it.
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章technobabel » 週四 1月 07, 2010 5:24 am

My Yoga instructor who is non-Asian and speaks no Chinese tattooed a Chinese character "放" on her wrist. She meant to convey the sentiment of let-go or emotional liberation. Is the word "放" the best choice?
As far as I know, Chinese do not use the word "放" all by itself. It is usually paired with another word to form a more complete meaning. I think the same logic applies with the word "up" in "Taiwan up". Grammatically correct or not, it just fall short in getting the point across.
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章Sherry Liao » 週六 1月 09, 2010 1:10 am

technobabel 寫:She meant to convey the sentiment of let-go or emotional liberation. Is the word "放" the best choice?


What about "空"? I think Chinese speakers would think it's closer to the concept, but I don't think an English speaker will like it.

In English, "空" is somehow related to "absent-minded" or "knowing nothing". Although "放" is not a good word here, it has got a much more clear definition and would not cause any misunderstanding.

I think it's the trick of language. For the same word, people might have different association based on their knowledge and past experience. Sounds like an excuse.... but it's hard for an English learner to think completely the same way a native English speaker thinks, for we are always interfered with information connected to our mother tongue. It's quite natural.

To be an international language, English should be more tolerant to users from different parts of the world. It's not a language owned by native speakers only. It is spoken by people from different cultures and with different mother tongues. I don't think it's wise for a native speaker to think that "We don't say it this way, so it's weird and it's not accepted and it's not comprehensible".

But as an English learner, and for a post that is posted on a forum of an English club, I should say that let's try our best to learn to think the way English native speakers think!
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章technobabel » 週一 1月 11, 2010 5:01 am

I did suggest the word "捨" as an alternative. The word "空" seemed to associates too closely with escapism and reclusiveness. Buddhism can be rather anti-competitive in a dissocciative sort of ways. We can't always run away from diffculties of our lives.

Obiviously, what seemed so obvious isn't always obvious to everybody.
Venturing into languages provides new ways to make "mistakes" that even native speakers haven't thought of.
From pure literal syntax stand point, the "real" meaning of "Taiwan Up" if you really think about it isn't "Taiwan 站起來"
This phrases forces the word "Taiwan" into a verb. For example, "wise-up" = 放聰明一點 and "gear-up" = 裝備起來.
Therefore, the closest meaning of "Taiwan Up" = "(使)台灣化" which is to suggest that "Taiwan" is a positive state (狀況) of being.
I am not abandoning Yoyo, I am just dancing slowly away from it.
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章charlienature » 週二 1月 12, 2010 9:55 pm

I like this slogan " TAIWAN UP " , it's simple and meaningful and smart : )
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章technobabel » 週四 1月 14, 2010 4:29 am

Staring at the Taipei 101 had just become a modern ritual during this momentary "transitional phase" from one yearly calendar to the next. During this highly emotional charged situation, who has the time to be verbose? It is best to be terse, succinct, laconic and to the point. I am sure that was Taipei 101 management's basis for "Taiwan Up" Not to mention the fact that the expected level of sophistication probably isn't as high as the building itself. Besides, the goal was to capture the hearts and minds of those whom identifies with this patch of land. Native English speakers aren't likely to be impressed no matter what was written.
I am not abandoning Yoyo, I am just dancing slowly away from it.
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章Sherry Liao » 週六 1月 16, 2010 9:20 pm

technobabel 寫:I did suggest the word "捨" as an alternative. The word "空" seemed to associates too closely with escapism and reclusiveness. Buddhism can be rather anti-competitive in a dissocciative sort of ways. We can't always run away from diffculties of our lives.

Obiviously, what seemed so obvious isn't always obvious to everybody.
Venturing into languages provides new ways to make "mistakes" that even native speakers haven't thought of.
From pure literal syntax stand point, the "real" meaning of "Taiwan Up" if you really think about it isn't "Taiwan 站起來"
This phrases forces the word "Taiwan" into a verb. For example, "wise-up" = 放聰明一點 and "gear-up" = 裝備起來.
Therefore, the closest meaning of "Taiwan Up" = "(使)台灣化" which is to suggest that "Taiwan" is a positive state (狀況) of being.


You are great, Wayne. I never thought of it.
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章Sherry Liao » 週六 1月 16, 2010 9:23 pm

charlienature 寫:I like this slogan " TAIWAN UP " , it's simple and meaningful and smart : )


Hi, Charlie. Welcome on board. :D
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章Sherry Liao » 週六 1月 16, 2010 9:38 pm

Staring at Taipei 101 in a cold and misty day could be sentimental. It makes me think of the days I saw it built from the ground up. Before that was Grand Hyatt Hotel. And before that were Taipei World Trade Center and International Trade Building, -- I remember at that time I was still a child and used to watch it rise floor by floor with workers on my way to school everyday. Taipei has changed a lot these days; however, what has not been changed is that we are still struggling for some international recognition. It is a feeling which might be hard to be conveyed by words -- a truly complex those Native English speakers would never understand.
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Re: Taiwan Up, Taiwan getting caught with pants down

文章technobabel » 週三 1月 20, 2010 5:13 am

Sherry Liao 寫:Staring at Taipei 101 in a cold and misty day could be sentimental. It makes me think of the days I saw it built from the ground up. Before that was Grand Hyatt Hotel. And before that were Taipei World Trade Center and International Trade Building, -- I remember at that time I was still a child and used to watch it rise floor by floor with workers on my way to school everyday. Taipei has changed a lot these days; however, what has not been changed is that we are still struggling for some international recognition. It is a feeling which might be hard to be conveyed by words -- a truly complex those Native English speakers would never understand.


"International recognitions" aren't exactly what it cracked up to be. Everybody is so pre-occupied with their own patriotic sense of duty and there aren't any more attention-span left. Unless it is truely amazingly impressive. Which is not that easy to pull-off.
Taipei 101 has become the de facto spiritual lighthouse for the citizens of Taipei. Ironically, It is an acquired taste. Before Taipei 101, it is unlike for somebody in Taipei to say, hey! you know what? Maybe we need a super tall skyscraper so, everytime we look up we can see where we are in relation to the skyscraper and some how feel better about ourselves.
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