Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週日 4月 07, 2019 9:37 pm

Tanya shared some interesting articles and video clips about fake news, which is hot on the news. With her permission, I take the discussion here under this thread. Hope we can have a fun and healthy discussion.
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週日 4月 07, 2019 9:46 pm

The following information is copied from our line group.

Tanya: this is the paper about Russia's disinformation strategy on US elections

Tanya:i wanna share with you guys, and hope you can notice some of the same traits thats also happening in Taiwan, the fake news and disinformation on social media, which are perprtrated by PRC.

Iris: The paper looks academically sound. It's going to take some time to digest it all. Do you mind giving some examples for what you see in Taiwan?

Tanya:ok, l will provide some later today. hope you don't think l am crazy or just another PDDer, cause public opinion is turning againts students from NTU and NCCU recently.

Iris:Understood. I think we are willing to take it from a more objective angle, just to see how the “models” explained in the paper applied in another environment. Thanks!

Tanya:this speech is talking about the paper l posted, listen to the video if you are too busy to read the paper

Michael: Tanya, this group is too quiet. So, no worries for sharing this kind of thought provoking information. It is very welcome.

Tanya: Thanks Michael!
When it comes to news about PRC, they will say it is a "假議題", or we are just students taking money from DPP to promote independence of Taiwan, and no one really wanna listen to the young students. Now the TV news channels and internet news are againsting NTU and NCCU, makes it harder to spread these kind of information.

Tanya: the paper is in English, so i think it may justify the information a little bit in this line group.

Tanya: another news in English
https://www.npr.org/2019/03/22/705809811/students-in-ukraine-learn-how-to-spot-fake-stories-propaganda-and-hate-speech
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週日 4月 07, 2019 9:57 pm

Tanya: Hi @Iris Wu , l decided not to give any example of models in Taiwan, cuz those cases are way too controversial recently in Taiwan and it will DEFINITELY start a debate here. All I wish is to spread the message to get you guys to know these things.

Iris: That’s fine, Tanya!
The links you provided with are good enough.

Tanya: Yeah! I am appreciated to own the right of free speech here in Taiwan.

Tanya: Please watch this, the war is on now
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPlzj4yfTj4&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

Michael: Yes, Tanya, "I may disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Long live freedom of speech!

Luis :if this is the case, it can also apply to how politicians use fake news and disinformation to influence people to see things their way, and to do things in their favour! It would apply to all the information we get, especially from the internet, wouldn't it? What to believe and how to think for yourself then? What's the freedom of speech anyway? If you do value it, never forget it lo~

Tanya: Yes, you can say that l am using disinformation to trick you guysor students are going nuts because of some DPP politicians are manipulating.
No one wants to be governed by the dictatorship of PRC. l really hope everything in that video is fake, everything is still OK.

Tanya: Like the video said, there is too much shit happening now, and maybe the information I possess create bias of how l view the stata quo.

Sabrina: Fake news, true news, he says she says
https://www.chinatimes.com/realtimenews/20150618003435-260402?chdtv
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週日 4月 07, 2019 10:02 pm

Tanya: Chinatimes huh
Anyone here is interested in this topic, you can pm me for more information.
Thank you

Michael: I just patiently finished the long speech video Tanya provided. It is informative and shocking. Now I know how Russia influenced US presidential election, and why Hillary lost it. The shocking part is how China government uses big data and high technology to control people. Sigh.....I believe there will be very little room for "dissidents" in China to survive.

Sherry: @Michael Liu Because it is an unlisted youtube video. Only those who know the link can view it

Wen-han: Actually there are someones promoting the dictatorship, under the protection of freedom of speech

Tashi: Yep, that's the beauty of it.

Tanya: Yep! chinatimes 中天 TVBS 東森 美麗島電子報,go google "親中媒體"
there a difference between freedom of speech and freedom of the press

Tashi: I believe if we pass ourselves off as good human, what we should do is using good value and system against all conspiracy since developing all sorts of conspiracies are also part of freedom of human mind.

Wen-han: Just like the promotion of one country two systems from Chinatimes, I think in a way it reflects the fashion of a portion of the Taiwanese

Tashi: It's like you can't expect no falling leaves but keep sweeping.

Tanya: https://www.upmedia.mg/news_info.php?SerialNo=60686%3F%3Dl
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週日 4月 07, 2019 10:05 pm

Wen-han: You may consider it nonsense, but the bottom line is, if it is legal, they still have the rights to publish it.

Tanya: https://www.upmedia.mg/news_info.php?SerialNo=60679&fbclid=IwAR3S5x37QHhJ0gkGCNuY1jfY6foulIO7pVB55RnzBX0pxsYGUy-g9hf2LGw
i recommend you read the articles first

Michael: Thanks, Sherry, Since these people want to spread their message out, why didn't they list the video on YouTube? After all, Taiwan is a free country, not like China.

Sherry: I do have my personal opinion why they make this video unsearchable. If we have a thread on the forum or a subgroup for this topic, I'd like to share my two cents there...
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週日 4月 07, 2019 11:03 pm

Before Sherry's two cents, I'd like to share mine first. :lol:

DPP lost the election last time. Did "fake news" cause its failure? I don't think so. To be honest, "fake news" is everywhere. Pro-China media is fake; the Liberty Times is no better. Thanks to our freedom of speech, people can chose to read what they want to read and believe what they want to believe. It's been chaotic for so long, why are DPP blaming it for its failure now?

It shouldn't be like this. But since the news reports have lost their authenticity, we can believe everything and also nothing. To me, the report of "fake news" is also possibly fake, so I don't take it seriously. 8)
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週一 4月 08, 2019 8:06 am

Another political question: Why a Taiwanese cannot be "愛台灣" and also "親中"?

It sounds OK to me if a Taiwanese is "loving Taiwan and also "pro-Japan", "pro-Korea", even "pro-Russia". But why does it sound awkward if one claims that he/ she is "loving Taiwan" and also "pro-China"?

Possible answers:
1. It's a fact. Any "pro-China" Taiwanese is not loving Taiwan.
2. Because China is our enemy.
3. It's a DPP patented slogan so if you put the two terms together then it's a wrong collocation.
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章tashi » 週五 4月 12, 2019 11:42 am

Actually, 賴清德 said 親中愛台 before. So it's about who said it. :lol:
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週六 4月 13, 2019 10:48 am


This guy just became DPP's best campaign worker for 2020 election.

圖檔
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Luis Ko » 週六 4月 13, 2019 4:10 pm

Rock 寫:
This guy just became DPP's best campaign worker for 2020 election.

圖檔



be it as it may, if you agree Taiwan is a democratic country. whatever the reasons are, fake news or not, that influence people into making a decision, we should just bear the result of majority people's choice together. that's the life we experience everyday under the so-called freedom of speech, especially during election days or when election is imminent. the same reason goes to whether to be unified with China, if that's decided by a large majority. it's democracy, isn't it?
i might be a cynic and, a sceptic as well but, i'm definitely not a bad person!!
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Sabrina Sung » 週日 4月 14, 2019 8:29 am

I read the story, while cultural revolution, they distinguished people to "five black categories" , "five red categories" ; you belonged the latter , anything you said is correct
nowadays, the young guys do the same actions , they needn't evidence, only if the news from the media they call "親中媒體" , they are fake news.

tashi 寫:Actually, 賴清德 said 親中愛台 before. So it's about who said it. :lol:
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Sabrina Sung » 週日 4月 14, 2019 10:15 am

just read the news, in my opinion, 王浩宇 made the fake news ; unfortunately, some guys still buy the story. :(
https://news.ltn.com.tw/news/politics/paper/1281376
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Sherry Liao » 週六 4月 20, 2019 10:02 pm

Rock 寫:Before Sherry's two cents, I'd like to share mine first. :lol:

DPP lost the election last time. Did "fake news" cause its failure? I don't think so. To be honest, "fake news" is everywhere. Pro-China media is fake; the Liberty Times is no better. Thanks to our freedom of speech, people can chose to read what they want to read and believe what they want to believe. It's been chaotic for so long, why are DPP blaming it for its failure now?

It shouldn't be like this. But since the news reports have lost their authenticity, we can believe everything and also nothing. To me, the report of "fake news" is also possibly fake, so I don't take it seriously. 8)


I think you should take it more seriously, Rock. :?

The recent wave of fake news discussions comes from the fear of media penetration from China, I would say. We may not have enough evidence that China has been trying to influence Taiwan’s public opinion. But the fear is REAL. People would not buy your opinions if you ignore their fears. They would only think that you are too naïve or too ignorant to accept the truth.

It’s my opinion that China’s media penetration is real. But how serious is it? The mix of information in the air makes it difficult to distinguish true from false. It is also difficult to tell which false information is from KMT, which is from DPP, which is from China or anyone else.
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Sherry Liao » 週日 4月 21, 2019 12:14 am

Tanya posted a link to Puma’s unlisted video in the line group:

中國如何利用假消息影響台灣? 臺北大學教授沈柏洋(Puma)告訴您!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPlzj4y ... e=youtu.be

I agree with Puma that we are all involved in an information war. The war has begun. No one can escape from it. It would be dangerous if we are unaware that at least some of the information we receive daily is deliberately remade to mislead us.

The problem is, this is an intangible war. We may not know who are attacking us and what weapons they are using. To make it even worse, we may be a weapon of our enemy while not aware of it.
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Re: Fake News (discussion from Yoyo line group)

文章Rock » 週一 4月 22, 2019 10:36 pm

Sherry Liao 寫:
I think you should take it more seriously, Rock.

The recent wave of fake news discussions comes from the fear of media penetration from China, I would say. We may not have enough evidence that China has been trying to influence Taiwan’s public opinion. But the fear is REAL....


Hey, I agree with you. But, "freedom of speech" protects my right, so I guess I can further express myself, be it naive or ignorant to others, right?

Again, I agree with you, the fear is REAL, but not for every one. Actually, I dare say that the fear is NOT REAL to some people, as long as they also realize that critical thinking and concrete evidence are most important than ever here in Taiwan. Any serious person shouldn't take those "possibly fake news" too seriously if there is no hard evidence yet.

Besides, blaming China is easier than blaming ourselves.

You are right, I should fear the possible conspiracy of China. But I also fear many other things: the blatant manipulation of ethnic division, the rising populism, the unreasonably phenomenal success of religious and political idols and their brainless followers. To be honest, the fear is too much; I am kind of numbed and paralyzed, and, of course, naive and ignorant, too. :cry:
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